Legislature(1997 - 1998)
04/30/1998 01:30 PM House RES
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HB 274 - OIL & GAS CONSERVATION COMMISSION CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN called on Representative Ramona Barnes to present the report on HB 274 from the subcommittee. Number 016 REPRESENTATIVE RAMONA BARNES stated the subcommittee has done extensive work on HB 274. She reported Howard Grey of Anchorage and past president of the Professional Geologist Association (PGA) was contacted at the suggestion of Leo Mark Anthony regarding the petroleum geologists in Alaska. He explained that there are between 130 and 140 American Institute of Professional Geologists (AIPG) members in Alaska who are registered with PGA. He further explained that the number could be doubled because there are between 130 and 140 geologists working in Alaska who have not registered with the association, but would otherwise probably qualify. He also estimated that of the 300 to 400 geologists in Alaska probably 100 are involved in some way with the oil industry and who may qualify under the bill to become a member of the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission. Mr. Grey upon receipt of the proposed committee substitute said that the changes to the existing law were fine and that it was a valid idea to replace the term "professional" with the term "petroleum" and cited arguments presented by Representative Joe Green that licensure is not mandatory to work within the industry in Alaska. When asked whether he thought the changes to the law would affect the size of the pool of applicants, he replied yes it was probable. However, he felt that the wording of the bill would likely ratchet up the quality of individuals making up the pool. The changes would give access to a greater number of individuals who would be more certain to qualify as members of the commission. In addition, defining the qualified geologist as a "petroleum geologist" would also help ensure well-qualified individuals for the commission. To use his words, he said it probably would result in ... "A pretty good field to draw from." REPRESENTATIVE BARNES further stated that Mr. Leo Mark Anthony of Anchorage did not recall specific numbers, but noted there are many registered geologists in Alaska. He also pointed out that AIPG is the primary qualifier. It provides qualified applicants with a certificate and the state provides registration upon the presentation of the AIPG certificate and the required money. Mr. Anthony suggested when seeking applicants for the commission one should probably look for qualified, registered geologists within the petroleum industry who have at least 10 years of experience. The experience would be necessary to assure a knowledgeable applicant. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES further stated that Catherine Reardon, Director of Occupational Licensing, Department of Commerce, explained the registration process under AS 08.02.011. She stated registration is voluntary in Alaska and there is no renewal process. The problem is that few other states do it like Alaska resulting in many geologists from other states applying and obtaining registration in Alaska. Of the about 400 geologists listed as registered, she estimates that only half live and work in Alaska. A similar problem exists when attempting to tabulate the number of petroleum engineers. Ms. Reardon noted that the records show a total of 89 petroleum engineers registered, and of that number, 40 have provided out-of-state addresses. That leaves just 49 instate petroleum engineers. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES further stated that in a letter from Assistant Attorney General Robert Mintz he indicated there were 579 petroleum engineers employed within the state of Alaska in 1996, the most recent year from which data are available. In both cases, it is unknown whether the individuals listed as petroleum engineers would actually qualify for the commission under the proposed bill. Mr. Mintz also pointed out that the number is not a reliable estimate for determining who would qualify under the proposal. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES further stated that Dave Johnston, the petroleum geologist on the commission now, explained that the term "petroleum engineer" is an imprecise definition. No one can statistically answer how many petroleum engineers there are or how many there are in each category or speciality, such as subsurface. Mr. Johnston felt that to obtain an accurate count most likely would require examining each individual and in whatever file is used. Yet, he does not think that it will change the numbers greatly. He also pointed out that the way to improve HB 274 is to change the word "or" to "and" under 2(A). Others, however, have indicated that such a change is unnecessary to redundant. He also suggested making licensure a goal rather than a requirement. There are many well-qualified engineers without licenses, although it is not difficult to obtain. Number 165 REPRESENTATIVE BARNES noted that there is a proposed committee substitute for HB 274, version 0-LS0998\Q, Glover, 4/28/98. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES explained the following language in Section 1 has been deleted: "Before making an appointment, the governor may solicit the recommendations of professional or industry representatives for appointment of a commissioner." REPRESENTATIVE BARNES stated it is unnecessary to include verbiage allowing a governor to seek council with professional or industry representatives when he already has that power. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES further explained that the previous Section 2 is now Section 1. On page 2, line 7, the language "and the person completes university or industry training" has been added. It was added with the intent of increasing the quality of the pools from which candidates are drawn for the commission. Number 196 CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked Representative Barnes which proposed committee substitute is the new one. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES replied version "Q." Number 0208 CO-CHAIRMAN BILL HUDSON asked Representative Barnes whether she has taken the proposed committee substitute and put it into the "Q" version. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES replied the "Q" version is the new proposed committee substitute from the subcommittee. Number 215 REPRESENTATIVE BARNES made a motion and asked unanimous consent to adopt the proposed committee substitute for HB 274, version 0- LS0998\Q, Glover, 4/28/98. There being no objection, it was so adopted. CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked Representative Barnes to explain the changes to the committee substitute again. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES explained the following language in Section 1 has been deleted: "Before making an appointment, the governor may solicit the recommendations of professional or industry representatives for appointment of a commissioner." REPRESENTATIVE BARNES further explained on page 2, line 12, of version "P", the language "including and completing course work" has been deleted and the language "and the person completes university or industry training" has been inserted. REPRESENTATIVE JOE GREEN noted his appreciation of the work that the subcommittee members have done. The bill is better. The only reason for the provision in Section 1, which has been removed, was to jab at the Governor. He has maintained steadfastly that there aren't qualified individuals causing him to go out of the realm of what is necessary for the job. For two years now he has nominated people who are obviously not qualified. Number 265 CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON made a motion to move the proposed committee substitute for HB 274, version 0-LS0998/Q, Glover, 4/28/98, out of the committee with individual recommendations and the attached zero fiscal note. Number 273 REPRESENTATIVE IRENE NICHOLIA asked Representative Barnes whether the "Q" version would still restrict the pool to 25 persons. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES replied it would not restrict the pool to 25 persons, according to the research. There are a lot of individuals who do not show up on the registers, but who work for oil companies. There is probably a pool of over 500. CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN noted that there being no objection to the motion, CSHB 274(RES) was so moved from the House Resources Standing Committee.
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